Non-24 Hour Circadian Rhythm Sleep/Wake Cycle Disorder

[Griffin]

New here. Someone told me about DSPS and I just read the wiki and it is spot on.

I suspect I am probably N-24 too - not by much, but left to myself entirely my sleep onset gets gradually later. Maybe I am 24 hours plus 10 mins !

This thread is packed with so much that resonates, but I also have some extras!

I started getting into trouble for going to sleep late as young as 5, tho I suspect from other snippets it really started when I was a baby.

Most of my adult life I coped. Sleep onset 2-3-or4 am, getting to work usually on time but with immense difficulty, laterly taking jobs where it wasn't a big issue and I could compensate by working a bit later.

Weekend catch ups. (and usually migraines). And yes I statrted out as a computer programmer. Spent my career in IT - difficulties got worse the higher up the ladder as management does not lend itself to sleep issues as well as programming.

I was diagnosed with RLS and PLMS.

The critical point in my life was after chemotherapy and radiotherapy.

The effect of radiotherapy (lots of it - to the breast) was an enlarged thyroid and sleeping literally 24 hours for 2 months - ie I spent 2 months asleep. Gradually it then reduced to 18 hours per 24. Approx.

The cancer treatment also triggered chronic fatigue syndrome and secdondary hypothyroidism.

I have also been on SSRI's and tricyclics for years as well.

So a number of overlaps with other posts here.

I am now resistant to all sleep drugs they are willing to prescribe. Melatonin worked well for about a year but has no effect at all any more.

One of my problems which probably belongs in another section is that I cannot function at all without the adequate sleep. That's the CFIDS. Having to wake up at around the time I would normally be asleep (like for a morning appointment at hospital) makes me very ill.

My current "pattern" is sleep onset at 5, 6 or 7 am. Wake time enormously variable. Wake time AND feeling well enough to be awake even more variable. Today's wake time was 20:00 hours p.m.

life? not really.

[Norway]

You do have some complicating factors; not too many of us have had cancer (knock on wood).

Just thought I'd comment on the diff between DSPS and N24. It's perfectly normal (if I may use that word about us) for DSPS to tend later and later for a time, like months, weeks or even days. But we don't go on 'round the clock like N24 does. At some point we either just stay at f.ex. 7 a.m. bedtime or, more often, snap back a few hours and start over. N24 people really do go to sleep an hour or so later per day, on and on 'round the clock.

Otherwise the two are very similar. We have, most likely, a 25-hour (or greater) circadian rhythm. We tend to be long sleepers (more likely 9-10 than 7 hours). We commonly do what I call my 36-hour-trick (which the literature calls a noncircadian day): Staying awake a whole day + night + day. We don't fit into 9-5 society, at least without extreme effort and detrimental effects on physical and/or mental health.

Parenthetically, I don't see how melatonin should work for a time, then stop being effective. Some people have no effect from it at all, some do. If it's stopped working, I'd suspect wrong timing. The timing is very tricky to get right. The dosage isn't so important. I started out on 3 mg, down to 1mg, then 1/2, now 1/4 and they all work exactly the same.

Good luck.

[Griffin]

Thanks for explaining the 24 hour thing so clearly.

I'm still not sure about it as it might apply to me - I would say before the chronic fatigue syndrome I did not have it, just the DSPS. But the effect of the chronic fatigue is that I do have periods when I sleep 12-18 hours. I can also find I don't sleep for 24-36 hours but feel really ill and so exhausted it seems impossible I cannot sleep. Perhaps that is the CFS tho and just sort of mimcs some aspects of the 24 hour thing.

I don't know about the melatonin. I have wondered whether I am getting faulty meds since it stopped working - I use Natrol.

One other aspect I forgot to mention is that, even when the melatonin did work, I used to get a very short period when I was able to fall asleep - ie. I would feel like the normal need to sleep feeling. If for any reason I didn't fall asleep in that patch, I would then not sleep all night. It could be that patch of time has got even shorter and I somehow miss it.

I've had something like that all my life anyway. If I don't go to sleep during the short need to go to sleep feeling, that's it, I can't sleep. Sort of like some other chemical kicks in and keeps me awake.

[Norway]

[Lz_erk]

Hello. I'm a 25 years old male, in Arizona (USA), with N-24 (undiagnosed, but I have every reason to suspect it). I'm also a previous homeschooler/unschooler with "some college." I'm unemployed, and divorced (with a child, who is with the other parent).

If you're reading this thread, there is a good chance you know why.

I could end my post there, but every scrap of information left for others with Non-24, any who are lucky and persistent enough to find this thread, is a gem. My mouth hung open in shock and adoration at the depression and compassion evident throughout the topic (including many other related threads on this board). I won't stop myself from naming Norway, Eric Van, Foamy_fan, and Acheron in particular, but everyone who's posted here has my appreciation (but some may deserve my apologies for forgetfulness ). But I've had it easy; I can only wonder where I'd be without my family's heroic support.

I wonder how far I'll go looking for a diagnosis and assistance, but I don't expect to find those answers here. I wish I could see the locations of more visitors to the thread; I'm curious if N-24 occurs more frequently in high Northern latitudes due to the differences in seasonal daylight, but I should probably keep my guesses beyond that to myself until I know much more about the condition(s).

I'd also very much appreciate knowing what careers have been found to be acceptable for those who have uncontrolled N-24. (I'm tempted to suggest "uncontrollable" N-24 at the risk of sounding positive.)

I've struggled with sleep since birth, from the stories my parents have told about taking "the night shift." By my sixth and final year of primary education (when my grades began to decline more sharply from their earlier "gifted" status), I was becoming hopeful with my progress towards learning to sleep in class with my eyes open.

I held a job for over a year in 2004-5 by sticking to a 48-hour schedule (when possible). I slept like a rock, and had to go three days about as often as I had to try to sleep after only the norm of about 16 hours of wakefulness. Audio alarms cannot wake me. I'm responsive basically only to pain when attempts are made to wake me after an average duration of sleep, which naturally results in an appropriate response to a painful stimulus, but rarely results in waking.

The time of my average "day" has increased until only recently, and eventually became hard to record in a sleep diary (which I'll make another attempt at keeping, since I'm now seeking treatment for a known disorder!), partially due to coping techniques involving meditation/self-hypnotism. The waking part of the day before yesterday was 60 hours long. I slept for 20 hours afterward, woke for a meal, and slept another eight hours. I was not particularly tired, but I did skip a "night" to re-floor my bedroom in one day.

I haven't always looked for the advantages of my apparently severe condition; before leaving public school, I made a determined, years-long effort to use natural and artificial light (and its absence) therapeutically, plus melatonin (which I found debilitating even in small doses), and other forms of circadian rhythm maintenance to control my condition, including diet, exercise and drugs. I've attempted to live with N-24 only after it played a major role in tearing down many things I had attempted to establish in my life.

It's easy to distrust even professional opinions with my strange factors -- to abbreviate: SCT, DH/Celiac Disease (also undiagnosed), and N-24 -- but I'll give the recommended therapies another try under professional prescription, if necessary. I'm curious how long it will be, if ever, until I can find assistance, or any appropriate job placement service. I'd also like to know if anyone has a reference to where in the states I could receive help of any kind, or any reasonable alternatives, especially if they can put my "individuality" to a productive use.

Sorry for the windy reply. Thanks again.

[Norway]

Wow, what a great letter! And at your age! You've figured it all out! God I wish there'd been Internet and some knowledge out there when I was your age.

OK, you're N-24, but those of us who only have DSPS can understand somewhat. And I tell you, you're good. Melatonin might still be able to help you, BTW, but it is very tricky to get the timing right. And a half a mg is enough for most of us, more than enough. But a N24 person can't just start it on any day of the month. You have to have a sleep diary that shows some regularity and start melatonin on the right day. Try some searches about blind people and sleep disorders / sleep-wake / circadian (lots of possible search words). There's almost nothing to be found about sighted people with N24 - tho they ( and you, I presume) do exist! Dr. A. Levy (Levy? Lewy?) in Oregon - look up him.

My latest hobby is contributing to Wikipedia. I have a half-written article which might interest you ----
EDIT: The completed article is in main space at Wikipedia now. "Sleep Medicine". About becoming a sleep doctor etc, likely some helpful links about finding one, too.

But do some telephone interviewing before choosing a "Sleep Center"! Make sure they've treated people like you before.

You've probably found the links I've recommended here before. The mail list at circadiandisorders.org would be good for you. A new site is http://DSPDMyths.info - a person in India, I think, who's posted some links.

Good luck!

(Edit: that link didn't work. Hopefully changed to one which does.)
(Edit2 - marked above.)

[Lz_erk]

"those of us who only have DSPS can understand somewhat."

According to the sleep charts I obtained from http://www.supermemo.com/articles/sleepchart.htm (from one of the links FROM a link you suggested), either N-24 is frequently diagnosed as DSPS (or vice-versa), or they are varying levels of the same dysfunction; but regardless, I have only every reason to believe that sufferers of DSPS can relate.

I'm unable to find a Dr. A. Levy/Lewy. Thank you anyhow; it's the closest I've been to finding professional assistance. I've mailed and called sleep clinics in my state, inquiring concerning which may have experience with "circadian rhythm disorders." I've also asked my doctors for referrals. I have had few results, and no helpful or positive results.

It CAN be severely depressing. In all observances there is nothing wrong with me; the closest thing to a diagnosis I have recieved is a recent court judgement finding me entirely capable of providing child support. My words refuse my efforts to encompass and express my frustration with societies, economies, medicine, and existence as a whole.

Instead, I'm interested in the root of the condition. Unlike the prediction in Wiki on N-24, I am hypersensitive to bright light, but this does not necessarily reflect proper function of the Retinohypothalamic tract (which would be my first suspicion in the search for a root cause) -- but since I AM highly (maybe even painfully) responsive to melatonin, this alltogether seems to me to be an acceptable basis for melatonin therapy, despite how repulsive I find the idea.

I joined the DSPS mailing list this morning and almost immediately recieved some slightly discouraging information concerning melatonin treatment. It would seem intravenous delivery would be the method of choice for a drug with melatonin's unusual and specific qualities, but this seems contraindicated not only by the possibility of complications, but also by my necessity to self-medicate -- here in the United States, melatonin is available as a "dietary supplement" and not Scheduled, controlled, or prescribed (to my knowledge) as ANY sort of drug!

I am being told not to self-diagnose and told not to be concerned -- told everything short of "do not to attempt to find solutions" -- but self-help is all that has been made available. Will the melatonin dosage necessary to entrain my circadian rhythm also be of sufficient potency to preclude (at all times) all activity outside of sleeping and eating?

If you, or if anyone else here, could provide detailed information on melatonin supplementation, I would greatly appreciate it.

Most importantly and less hopefully, I could ask why I should need to SLEEP normally in order to WORK normally; it seems the root of my disease is not at all in my retinohypothalamic tract or optic chiasma or suprachiasmatic nucleus, but in the flow of money. Is anything truly flexible available for those who have minimal accreditation and cannot work scheduled hours?

I'm curious about the possible prevalence or frequency of any disorders relating to sight in sighted persons diagnosed with (or suspected of having) a circadian rhythm disorder. For example (although unfortunately lacking in detail); I have very bad vision, corrected with lenses to somewhere within U.S. limits for automobile operation.

[Norway]

Oh, dear, I probably misled you about Dr. Levy/Lewy. I meant for you to look for his stuff as a researcher, not (necessarily) as a treating physician. He's done a lot w/N24 & blind people.

I, too, see N24 and DSPS as probably the same thing with the one difference that DSPS people's bodies acknowledge that there is a 24 hr day in nature and strive, often unsuccessfully, to adapt to it. N24 seems to ignore those 24 hrs altogether. But I don't know how many people agree with me on that.....

I was at my sleep specialist's the other evening (yes, he only sees people like me one day a week in the afternoon/evening!), and he told about another patient who'd struggled with a chaotic schedule for decades. They were both frustrated as light (& melatonin) weren't doing much for him. Then he was diagnosed with and treated for Restless Leg, in addition, and now the light treatment is helping. (The man's sleep-wake schedule is "nearly normalized", as the dr. put it.) A reminder that it is possible to have more than one sleep disorder! Perhaps not too common, but a possibility. I know that there are people with both sleep apnea and DSPS.

Response to melatonin seems to be very individual. Some say it depresses them or makes them groggy / gives them a headache / the next day. Some, incl my specialist, say it doesn't affect them at all. In any case, it's not more than a help; it's no miracle cure.

There's light sensitivity and then there's light sensitivity, not (necessarily) related. (1)There is vision; we see, using the rods and cones in the retina which we all learned about in Jr.High. (2)Recently a third type of photosensitive cells in the retina has been identified. Are you aware of those? As one paper puts it, they represent "the divergence of image-forming and non-image forming photoresponses in mammals" where the non-image forming responses are called the "adaptive ocular photoresponses." They have, as far as has been described, three functions: (i) quickly regulating the size of the pupil according to light levels, (ii) modulation of general activity and endocrine function (I don't pretend to understand what is meant by that) and (iii) circadian photoentrainment.

So it seems to me that everyday "hypersensitivity to bright light" may not reflect how sensitive these "new" cells are. (?) Except maybe as to their function regulating the size of the pupil. (?)

They do, however, at least to a degree explain what's long been a mystery about blind people. Most who have no eyes, have N24. Many who have at least one intact eye with no visual light perception, entrain circadian rhythms normally, while some do not. It appears now that this has to do with the newly discovered photosensitive RGC, retinal ganglion cells, and not to do with rods/cones.

I, too, don't understand how the USA and Canada can consider a hormone to be a dietary supplement. Can you buy the hormone insulin over the counter? I've settled on the Natrol brand liquid melatonin. It seems to be the same from one bottle to the next, and it's easy to try different doses of a liquid.

Gosh, this has gotten long! Keep in touch.

[Lz_erk]

I'll try to look up Dr. L again sometime. I'll keep an ear out, at least.

I'd like to have the advantage of professional examination in diagnosis and treatment -- to at least rule out additional conditions, as much as is possible, or even create a medication plan -- but when I've looked for medical care in clinical settings, the results have been uniformly detrimental.

I'm glad to hear a trustworthy brand name for melatonin, and I'm also glad that there are helpful and understanding practicing physicians SOMEwhere... (At this point, permanent relocation and adaption would be a welcome change, if it were possible.)

I was completely ignorant of RGCs until now. My knowledge of post-sixth-grade biology has been confined to random browsing. It's another part of the million-piece jigsaw puzzle, but I can only guess at which piece(s) are most likely to be missing from MY copy. Isn't "Circadian photoentrainment" a subdivision of normal "general activity and endocrine function?" I wonder if anyone can understand it.

Oh well. I have to give up on useful study (in the apparent absence of local professionals!) and get a burger-flipping job to pay support instead, or go to jail. And then another one when I break under the pressure, and then another one...

And everything of meaning is lost for want of a nail. (Except that I'm grateful for your support, and that of others.) I doubt I'll be able to avoid my "former pass-time" completely despite its abysmally useless conclusion, so I'll be back to post another example of an effective melatonin treatment plan, if one is found through web searches + trial and error.

[Norway]

Anyone in North America who has a circadian rhythm disorder may be interested in checking out the ongoing research studies at Northwestern University (Illinois) and at Univ of Calif at San Diego (UCSD). I've just added some info about these to the CRD board topic "Clinical Research study".

[Labrowski]

I kind of feel obligated to tell my story, seeing that your stories made me feel better about my situation and maybe my experience with the disorder may help somebody else. So here it goes. Keep in mind that my first language it not English, so there may be some grammatical errors.

Even though I'm undiagnosed, I'm 100% sure that I have non-24. Obviously I would be happy to be proven wrong, but no doctors have been able to do that yet.

It all started back in 2006 where I gradually over a period of a ½ year began getting more and more tired. Back then I was 16 years old and in 9th grade and due the low requirements from the school at that time, it wasn't really a problem, and not something I, at that point, really took much notice of. I kept staying up late each night because, like many other people, I didn't like to go to bed when I didn't feel sleepy. It was also in that period I had my first experience with microsleep (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsleep). Which I at that point didn't know what was and, again, really didn't take much notice of. Then came the summer holidays, where I, most of the time, lived from late in the afternoon to early in the morning. In August I started at an out of town high school. After the second day, I came home and basically collapsed due to being tired. I was tired from I woke up to just a few hours before I had to go to bed. Usually there I would "wake up" and not be able to sleep before around midnight, which would be way to late considering that I had to get up at 5.30. This went on a couple of weeks until I gave up and was transferred to a local high school instead, hoping that the later waking time would make a difference.

In this period I was examined by different doctors and took several tests, including one for depression, trying to find out what exactly made me so tired.

At around mid October I started skipping lessons at the new high school because I wanted to get home so I could sleep. First only a lesson or two, then only being there for a lesson or two. In the spring of 2007 I began skipping whole school days. Nothing could get me out of bed. I just wanted to sleep.

I've never been addicted to anything, but looking back its quite interesting to see what I would do just so I could sleep. I had always done my homework and never skipped school, so it was weird suddenly to just dont care about my own education and future.

Anyway, the search to find the problem continued. I was sent to a psychologist, tested for lung/breathing problems, allergy, muscles diseases, brain tumours ect. Nothing came up, I was perfectly healthy, except for the allergy test, but the treatment of that didn't do anything to help my sleep problem.

Around May (2007) I went to a neuropsychologist who, among other things, told my mother to just let me sleep. Shortly after that I dropped out of high school. I could now sleep as I wanted to and it was here I started going “around the clock".

During the summer and the autumn I was tested for narcolepsy, other, relatively, common sleep disorders, and epilepsy (the doctors thought that the microsleep incidents was small seizures) and probably some other stuff which I have now forgotten. All of which yielded negative results.

It was in October (still 2007), I discovered non-24, microsleep and so on. Some simple, and quite lucky, wikipedia searching brought me to, first the article on DSPS and then the article on non-24. I find it hard to describe exactly how I felt, but it was a mix of both being very happy that I now had a name for what was wrong with me, and on the other hand it was quite depressing to read that it was a chronic disorder and very difficult to manage. I gave the article to my mother so she could show it to my doctor (I was sleeping during the day at that time). He suggested the treatments that the article described and gave my mother a prescription for melatonin. “Here’s a prescription for melatonin, go experiment, I don’t care,” is what I’m imagining him to have thought.

I didn't take the melatonin, neither did I try to experiment with light therapy. My reason was that I wanted a diagnosis and someone who actually has expertise and experience with melatonin and light therapy to treat me.

In November I was referred to another sleep clinic, which could take me in 8 months later.

Besides not being able to have a job, get an education, have doctors that really believed in me or really have a social life due my weird sleep pattern, I was actually doing great! Now that I could sleep like I wanted to, I felt much better. I started exercising, which I hadn't had the energy or motivation to do previously. I started riding my bike (aprrox 30km, 18.75miles every day), started running and got a membership at the local gym, which I then went to 3 times a week. Not any of these physical activities has had an impact on my sleeping pattern.

In July 2008 I went to that second sleep clinic, and the tests came up negative. I showed the doctor the articles on DSPS and non-24, but she quickly disregarded them simply because they were rare (!). It’s like they don’t event want to hear what I have to say. If the numbers from the tests don’t immediately show results, they just ignore whatever else I have to say. She looked at my sleep diary and told me that my problem probably was that I slept too much (12hours, which I sometimes do, but not always....). She suggested that I should try and wake up and go to sleep the same time every day for a period, to try and get my sleep pattern back in place.

I did that for four weeks with the expected result.

The plan was that I was going to wake up at 8am and go to bed at 10pm. That worked the first 3 the days. The 4th day I went to bed at 10pm, but couldn’t fall asleep until 10.45. The day after that it was 11pm, then 11.15 and in the end it was 2am. That meant that I only got around six hours of sleep, and that is not enough for me. The “experiment” was I failure and I returned to my old sleep pattern again.

In March this year I have an appointment with another doctor at that sleep clinic, and I'm hoping that he will be listening to what I have to say.

Compared to many of you, I can see that I’m actually quite lucky, and not that hard hit, since I don’t have a job, family or pretty much anything else to take care of. I can’t begin to imagine how hard it must be to manage a job, family, and a sleep disorder while being sleep deprived. I only really lived like that for nine months and then I gave up. I don’t care how many mountains you’ve climbed or how many marathons you’ve completed, living with a sleep disorder that debilitating, when you can’t adjust to it, is seriously tough.

If you have any questions, feel free to write to me either through this site or via email at renoir [At] mail . dk
(email address scrambled to avoid spam)

In case you were wondering, I live in Denmark and I’m now 19 years old.

[Norway]

Hei Labrowski!

I could try to write to you in Danish, men jeg kan bare norsk...

One might think doctors would be happy to once-in-a-while have a patient with a rare conditon, for a change. But no, if it's rare, dismiss it.

It's admirable that you exercize and haven't succumbed to depression, as so many of us have. Finding out that the thing has a name at your age, rather than decades later, is surely an advantage, though not of much immediate comfort. You're also lucky finding a neuropsychologist who says to just let you sleep, and having a mother who goes along with that. As you know, it's important to have good health while you figure out what to do next.

Your 10 p.m. to 8 a.m. plan didn't work. A 2 a.m. to noon plan might have a better chance; the one is not the equivalent of the other. Stable DSPS is, of course, somewhat easier to tackle than N24.

My DSPS was diagnosed by a psychiatrist in Western Norway. I've been in contact with a young woman in Eastern Norway who was diagnosed N24 by a neurologist. She got a public subsidy to work in a publishing house starting about one hour later each day until she got to the week where she slept all day, then starting over. That worked for a year or two. Then she went the melatonin & light box route (which she had said she would never do) and got entrained to DSPS. (That was a few years ago and this is by memory, but it was something like that.)

Wikipedia has an article on "Sleep medicine". It appears that there is some expertise now in the US, though people have a hard time finding it. Norway may be a leader, though ordinary doctors here still haven't heard of circadian rhythm disorders. The UK seems to be way far down on the list, especially Wales. There's active research in The Netherlands, Israel and Japan as well as the USA, but that doesn't necessarily mean that patients are being treated as well as studied.

My specialist, a prof. of psychiatry, goes to a few psych conferences in various countries. He says that the subject of sleep is a greater and greater part of the program each year.

There must be one psychiatrist or neurologist in Denmark who knows about this stuff? Find her or him! (Or see if you can get your national health service to send you to Bergen Søvnsenter.) Good luck, and keep us posted.

EDIT: Link to Bergen Søvnsenter in Bergen, Norway: http://www.bergensøvnsenter.no/
They make it sound terribly expensive. The Norwegian national health service pays for it for me, and I have a light box, free, on long-term loan from Hjelpemiddelsentralen.

Edited again for typos. (hjelpemiddel, not helsemiddel )

[Labrowski]

Hi Norway

Thanks for your reply and the link to Bergen Søvnsenter. I don't think the prices are that bad (maybe due to conversion rates), but hopefully I can be treated here in Denmark.

[Labrowski]

I thought I would post a little update to my previous post about what happened at the sleep clinic in March.

I met with the chief expert at the clinic (not sure what his exact title would be translated to in English), and it seemed like he didn’t really take my problem seriously. I told him about how I would begin to feel if I forced a “solid” sleep pattern, and he replied with “I have heard all the excuses before”, and said that there was nothing to do. He claimed that melatonin did not work, at least not as something to be used on a regular basis and told me that the only thing to do was to get outside. I basically only had two options, according to him, force myself into a normal sleep pattern and get an education, or retire at my current age.

When I asked him, and I did multiple times, whether or not I could get the non-24 diagnosis, he replied with “and then what?” and then asking what I would use it for. He described the methods used in diagnosing the disorder, and that it would be very complicated to do. All in all he seemed very hesitant to diagnose anything or do any tests, and was quite arrogant to talk to.

I think it’s very odd that a doctor can’t understand the need for a patient to know what he or she is suffering from.

In the end I had to leave without any sort of result.
Depressing?

Well, not really. I had very low expectations because of all the other resultless appointments I’ve been through, and I had already decided what I was going to do next, whether or not I had a diagnosis.

My own doctor seems to agree with me that I have non-24, and at the moment I’m working on, with the help of the people around me, starting some kind of high school education in August, so that I can begin in college (not sure that’s the English equivalent, but something in that direction) within a couple of years.
It will be arranged in a way, so that I can maintain my desired sleep pattern and more or less be able to live the way that I do now.



The “get outside as soon as you wake up” experiment.

I did get one suggestion from the sleep clinic that I decided to try out. The idea is to get outside and be exposed to as much sunlight as possible from the moment you wake up. I tried it over a period of 7 days, getting up at 8am, only eating a very fast and small meal before going on my daily bike trip, which I usually do mid day. That trip is around 18 miles, which means that I'm outside for about 1½ hours. The “experiment” ended when I couldn’t fall asleep at the desired bedtime the 7th day, 10pm.

I then tried the same thing using a light box as the light source, but that didn’t work either.

The first method did seem to slow the process down a little, which is handy if I need to be awake at a specific time at a specific day, and need a way to, sort of, control the “rhythm”.

Maybe it will work for some of you.



As wrote in my previous post, feel free to contact me if you have any questions or comments regarding my experience with non-24, see the previous post for contact info, or simply reply to this thread.

[osarlo]

Dear Fellow Non-24s,

I have been living with Non-24 since I was a teenager (I am now in my early
thirties). From the moment I learned about my condition (self-diagnosed) until
this summer, I followed a free-running schedule, and this has greatly
constrained the choices thatI could make regarding a career and family.

But this summer I tried an experiment that has actually worked. Since July I have
been living on a diurnal schedule, and have been able to recover from even very
significant perturbations within just one or two days. I now sleep for 8 hours
every night, waking at the same time every morning (7h30 AM), and I almost
always feel great, having lots of energy: so much, in fact, that I recently began to
exercise in the mornings. And I have achieved this transition without the
long-term use of drugs or melatonin.

I have written about my experience on a blog posted at this address:

http://non24.blogspot.com

I wish you all the best of luck.

O.