Dental appliances CAN treat severe apnea

[RickRed]

I know many have been told only mild to moderate apnea can be treated with a dental appliance, however here's a good link the variety of dental appliances available. If scroll down to the section on Adjustable Mandibular Repositioning Appliances, and find the TAP, (the forth device down on the right side) here's the link:
http://www.quietsleep.com/oralappliancetherapy/oralappliance_descrip.htm

You will discover this has been approved to treat SEVERE apnea. So to all who've been told CPAP is your ONLY option, IT ISN'T.

Some may wonder why I keep posting sounding like a broken record. That's because of posts like this that was just posted on a different thread. This person went for a UPPP and found out that did not cure hs apena, He wrote::

[HH]

While I agree that different approaches will work better for some I also believe that it is critical that patients who choose these approaches keep a very close eye on their blood pressure.

ResMed did a study a while back, taking OSA patients with hypertension and putting them through minimal pap treatment and then autopap treatment. The results showed that the minimal treatment did stop the snoring and the patients felt better in the morning, but their blood pressure stayed the same as it was under no treatment. With autopap treatment the upper blood pressure number went down 10 points.

It seems, therefore, that for some the minimal treatment approach will not avoid some of the critical risks associated with OSA. The potential risks of hypertension, including stroke, make it very important for these patients to ensure that they have a therapeutic level of treatment, even if this means using a pap machine. For these patients a TAP may well help in reducing the level of pressure they need with the pap.

As for the person who would rather die than use a cpap, I doubt if they have had to recover from a stroke - yet. My wife is a Physical Therapist who has treated a lot of stroke patients over the years and I have heard too many stories over the years to believe that going through that ordeal is better than using a pap machine at a therapeutic level.

[Swordz]

I think the rediculous compliance rate of CPAP (about 50%?) is becuase people aren't properly shown how to use and adjust the equipment. Seriously, if docs took more time with patients, that compliance would be higher.

Now for the people that can't do the cpap thing (myself included), TAP and others are a godsend. CHEERS TO DENTAL DEVICES!!

[RickRed]

HH,

[Mr Mango]

Your absolutely right Swordz but they like all people doctors get tired of people complianing.

The message board does what they dont want to do, have not the time to do or cannot afford to do.

People who are sleep deprived get to the point very quickly.

I feel the work of compliance is being dealt with extremely well with RESMED in Australia. They have their clinics and give you the time to try, voice your oinipion and work well with specialists.

And I use C-flex but with a Resmed mask. No problem for them. All the staff are fantastic and it doesnt cost one cent except if you buy something.

But complaince is a personal struggle few overcome. I am compliant only because it would kill me not to be. If I could get down to mild OSA I would try and do without CPAP.

Compliance how hard you push it, can only be dealt with by the individual. If CPAP or PAP therapy cant be improved anymore then what we have then we have a major health problem. Dental or surgery has evolved not to challenge CPAP therapy as being wrong but to address OSA for those who cannot or find it too difficult to comply to positive pressure therapy.

We are talking 6 to 8 months attempting to comply to CPAP here not 2 weeks.

You cant leave them with no alternative as there are so many reasons why CPAP is hard to comply with.

[dizzy]

did you know lack of oxygen from untreated OSA can cause a person to make claims they cannot back up?

From the QuietSleep webpage, right on the FRONT page: :

FDA Approval: Approved for snoring. Not approved for OSA
Date of FDA Approval: Oct. 17, 1995
FDA Registration Number: K954324

Now which part of the above does it say it treats SEVERE OSA? or which part do you NOT understand?

Sometimes you have to be careful of the claims you make here, people follow your advice and it's wrong, they can end up with heart attack, stroke or even death.

[HH]

RickRed,

It's actually from a prospective of someone whose mother had OSA before anyone knew what a pap was and died from her second stroke. I saw what she went through rehabbing from the first stroke and my wife has talked a lot over the years about the problems stroke patients have.

I'll stick by my statement that patients using something besides a pap machine need to keep a critical eye on their blood pressure. Not just for the first week either, but for the entire time they are off of pap. It's a cheap price to pay to ensure that you are not at risk from a stroke.

[Less Sleepy]

Dizzy, I'm not about to trade my VPAP III for a dental device (although sometimes I wonder if my treatment might work better if I had a dental device AND VPAP III), but these guys are recommending that the treatment with the dental device be confirmed by sleep studies. If treatment is confirmed by sleep studies, what harm is there? CPAP can't do any better. Heck, UPPP is tried for severe sleep apnea, and follow-up with sleep studies is rare. Seems like what's happening with the dental device is a step in the right direction. I find it difficult to understand why insurance companies will pay for UPPP, which is totally unproven and irreversible, but not for the pillar procedure or dental devices, which can be supported, at least individually, by data.

[RickRed]

Dizzy,
To answer your comment:

[Mr Mango]

Here we go around the merry go round.

Dental works as much as CPAP for some and no one is going die if they try it. It isnt medication, injections, a wacko procedure or permanent surgery but a safe alternative which should be applauded.

Just for instance I myself have just be fiitted with a splint 8 days ago that has my jaw being re-aligned to make me grind on my back teeth.

I am on CPAP and now I have sleep apnea because my jaw has been drawn backwards. I was grinding on my front teeth with a splint.

So we see here the jaw plays a very big part in sleep apnea. I am tired when I wake up, sweaty through the day and continually yawning and sleepy tired. Also my B/P was 190/110 when usually it is alot lower then that. Nothing has changed but wearing this splint.

The hospital has paid for a taxi to get my wife to work because they need the staff and I cant drive because I am that sleepy. This is a real experience and may well need intervention from both dental and sleep specialist to rectify.

So lets be polite, be correct and helpful. If dental, ents and sleep specialist are working together finally why cant we. Absolutely no one is going to die trying any dental appliance. The leading sleep specialist of the world are behind the dental approach as an alternative for those who cant comply to CPAP why then bicker ( and I dont like that word but I cant think what else fits )of all the places in a support group who are trying to help each other.

I maybe speaking strong but I am tired, my jaw, my face, my ears, teeth or muscles in my mouth and neck hurt. So do I throw away my splint until my appointment on tuesday or find some way to turn my C-Flex up. Use the old splint maybe is the way.

So it is really timely to see this argument. I have also been told that some people have to have dental and CPAP to help their sleep apnea. I dont think we need another branch of the message board help these people to stop disagreements but some blending across branches of the message board like we who have Narcolepsy and OSA do and appreciate.

I cant help it if I have multiple problems and if someone comes across from dental with an opinion well it might be just the thing some one needed to hear. There is no crime in helping particularly when it may help. And by the way I do miss greatly the effectiveness of my CPAP pressure.

[Mr Mango]

I forgot to mention that HH's point on blood pressure when trying anything new is very important.

From 140/85 to 190/110 in 8 days proves his point and also goes to the jaw being brought forward helping OSA or curing it.

On reflection of his point which I just had a quick look at, ( I took my B/P at 5pm yesterday so maybe its going up higher then that in my sleep ) I am not wearing that splint until I see the dental specialist. My sleep specialist works on the same floor as him at the hospital I attend so that has got to be a bonus.

[RickRed]

HH,

[Less Sleepy]

Everybody should be keeping an eye on their blood pressure. That applies no matter how your OSA is being treated, or for that matter, whether or not you have OSA.

[HH]

RickRed, the basis for my comment was the study that showed patients with hypertension did get relief in terms of feeling refreshed and not snoring, but had no improvement when using less than a therapeutic level of pap treatment. I didn't say that people shouldn't use other devices, but that they should keep a close eye on their blood pressure. It's not that difficult as home units are fairly inexpensive and easy to use.

As far as people using something besides a pap, I'm all for what ever works for them, be it a dental device, TAPs, etc. I can only recommend the type of pap I use (an autopap) and the brand (ResMed) because that is all I have experience with, and that experience has been successful. I don't knock other options, but in the case of non-pap treatments I do recommend a conservative approach in keeping a close eye on blood pressure because of the high risk associated with OSA patients.

[Swordz]

You know i just realized I had higher blood pressure than normal for my age, even @ age 18. I"m 23 now, and only 170 lbs, but you know apnea affects everyone and everywhere.

Do people that use dental appliance with CPAP use it just to get pressure down? Wow, I don't think I could do dental and cpap. Anyone on here use them both?

And anyone know about the magnets in the throat to keep it open? Read about that somewhere, but can't find much info on it.

Ha... don't u love how random i am?!?